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  • Tushar Patekar

    Hi,

    Will the ionic/core components stable ??.

    Regarding issues, Can we have a page which will have top issues which you guys are currently working on. I think it would’ve been great for us developer.

    • Mike Hartington

      The core components are currently pretty stable right now, we’re finishing up some tests and navigation work to make sure everything it perfect.

      regarding the issue page, that’s a great suggestion! I’ll bring it up to the team!

    • Var

      Not trying to be offensive… but not sure the thought behind questions like “will it work”, “is it stable” , “is it bug free”. Of course anyone will do their best .. but this is software… bugfree can’t be a promise only a goal.

  • faraazc

    Thanks Mike for the clarification . Really appreciate all the efforts ionic team is in to. Loved to hear update with respect to virtual scroll .Excited to try v4 and first thing with virtual scroll plus infinite scroll. Thanks again..

  • Chris VanderKooi

    I can’t contain my excitement about Angular Router Integration. Navigation for PWA’s in 3.x is rough, so I’m very excited about this. Really looking forward to the v4 alpha to checkout out the navigation changes!

  • abuassar

    what will be the minimum run-time requirements for v4 regarding android and ios?

  • Marcus

    I’m really excited about the ng router, me and the NavController are not the best of friends. I’m also very excited in general about the path you’re taking with Ionic 4. I hope we’ll start seeing some (pre-)releases soon!

    • Fabio Tandoi

      I hate NavController too 😀

  • Plínio Naves

    Hello Mike, thanks for the great work!
    Any scheduled release date?

    • Mike Hartington

      Soon…..
      No date right now, but when it’s ready, we’ll let people know!

      • Gabriel Barbosa

        Can’t wait to see Virtual Scroll actually working!

      • amine da

        2018?

  • masimak

    Thanks for the update Mike. You mention using ngrouter in v4. Is this opt-in or will be replacing the current router? Also you mention integration with ngCli. Was actually wondering about that, now that #ionic will be framework agnostic if we would have to bootstrap and build the app as a normal angular project and where would that leave the ionic-cli. Would love to see the UI running in a web worker as is possible in vanilla angular projects today with different bootstraping that was not possible in ionic up to now, if that is the case.

    • Mike Hartington

      The Angular router would replace our current routing system, from an internal point of view. But we’re working out the final details to make the whole process feel very natural.

      As for the CLI, yes the CLI would instead be starting a project using the base templates for the framework of choice. So you would have a base Angular project template, and a base Vue/React project later on.

      Regarding Web Workers, yes! This should be possible now that we’ve adopted the Angular CLI

      • Ingo Bürk

        > The Angular router would replace our current routing system, from an internal point of view.

        Does this mean the API to the user stays the same or can we actually use the Angular router directly?

  • msamastur

    As someone who has spent quite a bit of time reporting bugs and creating repos demonstrating the problems just to see them being completely ignored afterwards, I am worried about the part of “closing issues with no activity”.

    How about if you closed only those, where the last meaningful response was from your team member? (or even better, when that response had a question)

    My last year’s experience certainly robbed me of will to become more involved with the project as pretty much all of it was a complete waste of time on my part. I doubt I am alone. I would love to get a reason to change my mind.

    • cocowalla

      I’m with you on this one – so many issues get closed by members of the Ionic team, with *no comment* when they do so. Incredibly frustrating.

      Some issues for rather critical things, such as sourcemaps not working, are also ignored for months or even years.

      • Mike Hartington

        Hey there! This is certainly something we have do when closing issues. When an issue is closed, we do post a response if it’s no longer valid or stale. If it’s something fixed by a PR/commit, we try to close the issue via the commit, so we follow up with a comment saying `fixed via `.

        • http://www.codingandclimbing.co.uk Dave

          Sorry Mike, but time and time again, issues are just left to rot, with no word from the team, the situation is just dire. Check out MY open issues (daveshirman) if you need proof. I really feel the team needs to do better in this regard if it wants to avoid a mass exodus of developers.

    • http://www.codingandclimbing.co.uk Dave

      Could not agree more, well said.

      Especially agree with your much more sensible suggestion of only closing bugs where the last meaningful response is from the team itself.

      Unfortunately, I feel that this post is too little, too late. With emerging alternatives such as Flutter, which is incredibly performant and backed by Google (potentially first in line to become the language of its new OS Fuchsia), I can’t honestly say it’s going to be a good time-investment staying with Ionic Framework given this poor developer experience over the last 12 months.

      • yesimahuman

        We apologize deeply for letting many issues get too long in the tooth. The point of the blog is that we’ve actually been working on fixing a lot of them, just in the background and we haven’t really communicated that. We’re going to work to get better on that front.

        re: Flutter, we’re glad to see more options in the space (though flutter can’t support Progressive Web Apps). However, I see over 2,400 issues open on their github right now: https://github.com/flutter/flutter/issues. It’s clear that teams have to prioritize working on the product with working on digging into issues, following up, etc. and right now many teams like Ionic (and, clearly, Google) are completely overwhelmed with open source issue counts without using automated tools and bots.

        We want to do a better job, and we will. Many of the issues that were left open will actually be resolved, and with tools we are going to start using, we hope to keep issue count better managed indefinitely.

        • http://www.codingandclimbing.co.uk Dave

          Ok fair enough, agreed. Thanks for your reply. Some very important questions though:

          1) Flutter feels absolutely native, it’s quite incredible. Ultimately the user experience is the important factor. Sure there are loads if issues, but it’s in beta, Ionic has been in ‘production’ for ages and still has glaring issues that shouldn’t be in a production branch. How ‘Native’ will the newer components of Ionic REALLY feel?

          2) Ionic Angular 4 – Honestly, what are the chances of being able to drop in the replacement components into a non-trivial existing app without spending 3 weeks refactoring all the pages? If this isn’t going to be easy, existing apps will just rot as developers abandon them and move to a different framework, e.g. Flutter, ReactNative, etc.

          3) PWAs – I honestly feel this is an over-hyped fancy term for web apps. I understand their benefits, but the whole point we use these cross-platform frameworks is because we want to produce installed apps for iOS and Android, the web version is 3rd (if at all released), not the priority. Will Ionic 4 onwards acknowledge that or is the shift to PWAs a trend towards leaving focus on installed apps?

          • yesimahuman

            1) Getting low level native performance been possible with other frameworks this whole time. If that really was the major deciding factor for most teams no one would have used Ionic in the first place. If that really is your most important metric, I recommend building native apps and not using Ionic. While Ionic apps work great from a performance standpoint for a large majority of teams, others might need to get closer to the metal.

            That being said, there are cases where a native UI element/system is useful to use in your app, and since you can interact with those elements with Cordova and (soon more easily with Capacitor), that’s enough of an escape hatch for many. Trying to make this easier with Capacitor: https://capacitor.ionicframework.com.

            2) While it’s not going to be as easy as flipping a switch, we believe developers will put in the small effort required to upgrade when they see the significant load and bundle size improvements, along with Ionic using more stock Angular APIs (if you’re using the Angular version, of course). Additionally, many in the community are excited about using Ionic outside of Angular (such as in Vue) and this will be their first chance to do so.

            3) For PWAs, we’re going off of community demand here. Progressive Web App content and articles are, by far, our most popular pieces these days. Ionic has always targeted web developers, and for many web developers, PWAs represent a full embrace of the technology they know and love. That is compelling. Along with demand we see on the enterprise side for more control, faster iteration prospects, and more accessibility of their product, we feel like PWAs are going to be a significant opportunity for us and Ionic developers everywhere. Tweet for reference: https://twitter.com/Ionicframework/status/943219478460076032

          • msamastur

            I looked at Flutter, but what keeps me back is lack of support for SVG and displaying HTML. This may not be a problem for every project and certainly is not for all of them.

            We used Ionic because it enabled us to easily leverage existing team’s knowledge. It was a safe choice to start with something where you can at least fix stuff more easily and importantly understand if the problem is us or not. And too often it is not us. Or to put it differently, Ionic is the only tool in my toolbox where when something doesn’t work, I don’t immediately assume it is my fault.

            While personally I find PWAs exciting, we did not pick Ionic because of them. With our experience I doubt we would now even if it was now something we wanted. We already built what could potentially be built with Ionic using only Angular and Material design components.

            Bug count is not everything either. It is not the number of open issues that Ionic has that bothers me, it is the lack of attention they too often get. And we cannot even buy a better support.

            What we can buy is a set of tools we are not particularly interested in that will likely be abandoned in another couple of years as many before them have been.

            I am sorry for this very negative tone. My love-hate relationship with Ionic felt too little love lately. I hope this company matures and Ionic with it.

          • yesimahuman

            We do offer support for large teams/enterprise today. On the plus side, Ionic the company is making money now, with healthy growth. We had to find our way a bit and built some products that weren’t the right fit. We’ve blogged extensively about this and we appreciate the community understanding that. We have more resources today than we’ve ever had, and I expect we’ll be able to tend to some of the things we haven’t been able to focus enough on recently. Cheers.

          • Digambar Vibhute

            Cheers

          • cocowalla

            Here here! I’m also sick of what feels like Ionic constantly trying to shove PWAs down my neck – please Ionic, just focus on *Ionic*!

          • yesimahuman

            It’s not either or. Making Ionic work better on the web means it works better when running natively. There isn’t a tradeoff here.

          • cocowalla

            Given the number of outstanding issues, how shockingly old many are, issues being closed without comment after several months etc, I’d respectfully disagree. You can’t do *everything*, and (personally, at least) I’d rather you focussed on *one* thing – Ionic.

          • yesimahuman

            The entire point of this blog post is that we _are_ working on those. That work just isn’t being communicated back on those issues. I can assure you we are focusing on Ionic, and we have been. PWAs are really just web apps, and it’s not any extra work for us to support them, but we can educate and make it easier to use some of the APIs around them (service workers, etc.)

  • Tony Awad

    Hello, very nice article. I have a question about the Angular Router. Currently I think the ionic router is much more simple and more elegant than the Angular Router. Especially the way the ionic router handles navigating to pages and passing objects / parms along the way, it’s simply great. I might be missing something, I am basically looking for some feedback on how the Angular router is better? I think the angular router is behind by a couple years compared to the ionic router.
    Thank you!

    • Elias Soares

      Angular router isn’t buggy like ionic’s one. And makes more sense using an widely adopted router, of course. There are more clever ways to share objects between routes.

    • yesimahuman

      We’re not supporting it because it’s inherently better than ionic router. Rather, some teams want to use the stock angular router instead of ours, and we need to support that. We will still have our own router and Mac if you want to use that!

      • Tony Awad

        Perfect, Thank you! Great to hear.

        • yesimahuman

          Yep! I messed up my double negatives in the above. We’re supporting it, but it’s not necessarily “better” than our router, just different. Cheers!

  • Ingo Bürk

    Now the only question is: when will that release happen? 🙂

  • Veni

    Hi Mike, Thank you for the update. Looking forward to Ionic 4! Two questions:

    1. What’s the best way to get ready for the release? By getting familiar with the 3.9.2 release?
    2. With Ionic 4 would we be able to work with other frameworks like Vue.js? Where can I find information on how to use other frameworks with Ionic?

    Thank you for all your hard work. Can’t wait!

    • http://janpiotrowski.de/ Jan Piotrowski

      Hey @disqus_uKqU9IcfVu:disqus, from how I understood it:

      Re 1) Having your project on the most current version of Ionic is certainly helpful, as the upgrade guide sure will assume the project being quite current. (I created https://update.ionic.zone/ to help with that – it takes your current `package.json` and updates it to any version and gives instructions what to do update your app code)

      Re 2) The `@ionic/core` web components will be usable everywhere – so also with Vue.js. A few people already played with that, so googling “Ionic Vue.js” brings results like this article from Paul Halliday: https://blog.paulhalliday.io/2017/10/04/how-to-use-vue-js-with-ionic-4/ but also even an article series from (the always excellent) Josh Morony: https://www.joshmorony.com/learning-vue-for-ionicangular-developers-part-1/

      • Veni

        Hi @janpiotrowski:disqus, I’ve looked at Josh’s tutorials. I haven’t come across the article from Paul though. Thank you! I’ll take a look.

  • Elias Soares

    We are really disappointed about many SERIOUS issues being left on v3. We are developing a v3 based application, but there are many issues that takes hours to find an workaround.

    I really love features that v4 will introduce, but unfortunately, it doesn’t have a public beta (have?), and we are forced to develop to a DEAD v3 full of bugs.

    • yesimahuman

      Ionic 4 *is* Ionic 3 just with those issues improved. Just because we’re incrementing a version number doesn’t mean v3 users can’t benefit! We *are* working on them, and we are providing a natural way into the future. Again, this isn’t a 1 to 2 style migration. Don’t get so hung up on version numbers!

      • Heshyo

        You need to understand we build app for clients and like someone else said, we can’t just tell the client we won’t fix a bug in the app because the Ionic team is working on v4.

        No one cares whether Ionic is called 3.9.2, 42 or Lollipop, the only this we care about are our live or soon to be live apps that contain bug. The infinite scroll bug has been reported 9 months ago. That’s 9 month at least with a bug in the app. Fortunately some users provided some hacks. As we have no idea when v4 will be out, we have no idea when this and other bugs may be fixed (and new versions may introduce new bugs).

        • radzik

          So… that’s what I thought. A post regarding ‘issue with issues’ was added, it is now comfortable to stay silent for next 6 months. @yesimahuman:disqus

  • Patrick

    Will you be releasing a migration doc to walk through how to migrate a reasonably complex app from v3 to v4? I’m very excited to use this, and it will also make it easier to migrate to Capacitor when that time comes.

  • Digambar Vibhute

    nice

  • https://viperdev.io Lasse Schuirmann

    Hey,

    you might consider using https://GitMate.io . It features automatic labelling and duplicate recognition based on a number of machine learning algorithms and can easily be used alongside Probot.

    Disclaimer: I’m not only a heavy ionic advocate but also the CEO of GitMate. Found this by accident though ^^

  • radzik

    Oh, so basically you say you’re leaving us with dead, full of bugs version of Ionic for some more time. Assuming you don’t even know prediction date of release (come on, can’t say a month name at least?) it will not be somewhere soon. Last release date is November, 5 months ago. I was using Ionic for a private project, but it must be a nice feeling for people who picked it up for commercial solution.

    • yesimahuman

      No, that’s *not* what we’re saying at all. We’re making a lot of key improvements to Ionic, many of which the community has been asking for for months/years. We’re putting those into Ionic 4 which you can upgrade to when it’s ready without a lot of work. Don’t get so hung up on a version number!

      • radzik

        Sorry if I sounded mean, don’t get me wrong, I am waiting for the update and I do appreciate your hard work.
        But something went terribly wrong here and you seem to continue it. I dont think there is anything good in your current flow. Right now we ARE left behind with frozen software containing bugs. For months. I – as a developer – might even buy it after that blog post – but let’s try to explain it to the client: “sorry, we won’t fix that bug you’re complaining about, because there won’t be any update for next half year”. That whole process you’re working on should be split into parts – you’re trying to deliver too big release I think. IMO you should filter out the list of issues, or even freeze it, and just do a core release and bother about the issues after it – come back to the previous flow. I just can’t get out of my mind the fact that I might’ve done a wrong choice sticking to Ionic. But hey, that’s just my opinion, please don’t worry so much about it.

  • Kevin Bezold

    Hi Mike,

    Will you be providing unit tests for all functionality so that you know that there are no regressions from the current production version?

  • AndWei

    I’m a little concerned about the bot closing old issues. That means there could be important issues out there which are silently closed and forgotten about. It’s a good way to keep open issue counts down for the bean counters, but it doesn’t help issues get addressed.

  • Guilherme Cardoso

    Hi,
    How about v1. Will you still fix major issues?